Why People Become Christadelphians

Christadelphians singing praise to a God that
only exists inside their own minds
The overwhelming majority of Christadelphians are converted because they are born into a Christadelphian family and they adopt the faith of their parents.

Generally speaking most children accept the family religion. Catholics beget more Catholics, Protestants beget more Protestants, Muslims beget more Muslims and Christadelphians beget more Christadelphians. So on it goes, around the globe in all religions.

Young minds are naturally attracted to adopt the beliefs and ways of their parents. To do so bestows an evolutionary advantage and that is why this behaviour is born and bred into us all. Since the time that Homo Sapiens first left Africa, survival critically depended on families and clans remaining together and not being dispersed. Families that split up would soon be lost to posterity and their genes not passed on.

The children of Christadelphian parents who follow their parents into the family religion are not displaying "faith", they are obeying the instructions coded into their genes and adopting the mindset and beliefs of their parents.

Adolescents think that they are rebelling against the authority of their parents, but in reality they are following in their parent’s footsteps. Tell any Catholic, Protestant, Muslim or Christadelphian that the primary reason that they maintain their affiliation is because of childhood conditioning and they will reply that you are mistaken. They will claim that they hold their conviction because of the authority of the Papacy, or that they object to the authority of the papacy, or the prophet was inspired by Allah, or that Dr Thomas rediscovered the Truth. However the end result is that religious affiliation is not so much a matter of faith and conviction, but rather it is a result of a genetic lottery.

The majority of humans are born into their religion. That is how it has been since the beginning of history. Every religious person claims a personal conviction and maintains that they have thought it out for themselves and formed their own independent opinion by vigorously examining their own beliefs. But the reality is that the “churn” of people switching between, or abandoning belief systems is very small. Childhood conditioning has created a powerful cognitive bias in their minds towards a certain religion that is almost impossible for them to overcome.

It has nothing whatsoever to do with "faith". It is like an addiction to crack cocaine or nicotine that cannot be broken. The great majority of Christadelphian offspring will be baptised. Childhood conditioning has "hooked" them and they are unable to escape from the family religion. The religion is actually a nonsense, but to the infant mind it all makes perfect sense to believe what they are taught by their parents. As their minds mature the imprint of that conditioning becomes stronger, not weaker.

It is not just the Christadelphians, all childhood religious imprinting works the same way. "Give me a child until he is five and I will give you a Catholic for life" is the Jesuit pledge. I was a Christadelphian child until I was fifteen and it took another twenty wasted years before I could shake my mind free. I was lucky to escape.

Tens of thousands of Christadelphians are still trapped in the Christadelphian belief system convinced that they are there because of the exercise of their own free will and intelligently considering the facts. But they are wrong. They are like North Korean children praising "The Dear Leader" because that is what they learned from their parents. It is NOT faith - it is an invisible, mental, genetic trap.


Christadelphians are increasingly
anti-science
Because the walls of the trap are invisible they cannot escape because they do not see the walls of the trap and they think themselves to be free. But they are not free. They are held in a matrix that has an overwhelming power to fool their minds into thinking that a nonsensical religion, completely lacking in rational evidence, is "The Truth" when in reality it is a fantasy.

Is it God's purpose in the "Latter Days" to confer salvation only on the descendents of a tiny number of families primarily in the Anglo-Saxon English speaking area of the world? The Bible certainly does not predict such a bizarre outcome. So why has it worked out that way for the Christadelphians?

It has worked out that way because a minor Nineteenth Century American revivalist sect has survived into the Twenty First Century by being handed down through families that have shut their minds to the realities of what is going on in the outside world.

The Amish and other sects have survived for exactly the same reason. It has nothing to do with faith, or God, or the Bible, or anything at all supernatural or divine. John Thomas's beliefs have been preserved in families who are unknowingly obeying their genetic instructions to preserve the family religion.

Those same genes were bred into their ancestors in Africa hundreds of thousands of years ago as a way to strengthen families and the clan in order to improve the chances of survival in a hostile world. It's not Christadelphianism that is in their genes; it is the preservation of family ways that is in their genes.

If they had been born Amish or Mormon they would be Amish or Mormons instead of Christadelphians. It is not "faith" or divine providence, it is a refusal to let go of the past and use the mind productively. It is the natural human tendency to take the easy option and avoid facing hard realities. Christadelphianism is not a collection of God's saints; it is an ostrich with its head buried deep in the sands of time.

Therefore I observe a disturbing principle operating: The world is populated by billions of humans who are following thousands of different and exclusive religions into which they have been born by a mindless genetic lottery.

They are all convinced that they have thought it out for themselves and that everyone else in all of the other religions is wrong. You could argue that most of them go along with the family religion because it is the easy option. But, challenge the faith of any of these people and you will be surprised at the vigour with which they defend their position.

Because the great majority remain in the beliefs into which they have been born, it must be obvious that, re-examining those beliefs rigorously when of a more mature age, is not the determining factor in establishing faith or conviction. Instead it appears to me that childhood conditioning is the causal factor. “But I re-examined my beliefs rigorously” a believer will claim. My rejoinder is: “Yes - that’s what they all say!” "Re-examining beliefs rigorously” almost always results in the subject reinforcing his previously held belief in the family religion and often makes him into a stronger adherent and promoter of the family faith.

That is what happened to me. I know because "I've been there and done that". I was as misguided as the Christadelphians who remain in the religion now. I am not smarter than them because I left; I was just extremely fortunate that things worked out for me the way that they did. They are unfortunate because they did not get the break that I did.

Why People Join Religions

A minority of people join a new faith which is not the family religion. A small number of people convert to the Christadelphian religion when it is not their family religion. However when you investigate the real reason why they converted it usually falls into one of the following categories:

1. They marry INTO the faith. Therefore romance or sex is the inspiration for their conversion, not intellectual conviction. If challenged they will deny this. But as it is a world-wide, faith-wide phenomenon it is quite obvious that the desire for sex and romance preceded their declaration of "faith" in the new religion, or in Christadelphianism. One Christian sect "Hookers for Jesus" recognizes the power of this basic human instinct and uses sex as the primary method of conversion. Sure, it can result in conversion, but it can hardly be called "faith". The mind has been tricked into believing something because of a greater payoff. The payoff is a partner, not life after death. The brain knows that a partner in this life is worth far more than the illusion of life after death for which evidence is totally absent.

2. They join the faith because they are expecting material reward. You only have to observe the Christadelphian "conversions" in Eastern Europe and Russia etc to see this happening. In the process of time the Christadelphian religion might eventually transform into some sort of social welfare organization rather than a religion and that would be no bad thing. But converts rising from the waters of baptism with hands held out for welfare makes a mockery of the faith. Bribery is NOT conversion.

3. They join the faith because they desire social acceptance and fraternity. I have seen this happen on several occasions during my time in the Christadelphians. One of the people that I "converted" joined for that reason. I could have told him that we were aliens from another planet for all he cared. He was just lonely and we were the answer to his problem. He died in the faith and we gave him a good send-off. But we did not send him to God's Kingdom. We sent him to the grave and that is where he will remain for all eternity, along with all the other Christadelphians and all the members of every religion that has ever been or that ever will be. It was all an empty sham except for the fact that he did find some friends in his declining years. That was the only good that came of the whole thing. If people want to join the Christadelphians to make friends then I'm all for it; but let's not kid ourselves that faith has got anything to do with it.

The reality is that it is extremely difficult to get anyone at all to join the Christadelphian religion for the biblical reason - that they have been converted by the power of the Holy Spirit operating through the Word of God. You know from your own experience and I know from mine that Christadelphian preaching is a thankless task. It is extremely rare that you ever convert anyone at all unless it is for one of the reasons given above and those reasons are NOT biblical conversion; they are decisions arrived at as a result of faulty cognitive bias or pressure.

Christadelphians stay in their religion because the faith acts as a network of social involvement and support. To leave the religion means to be judged and ostracised by one's relatives and peers and no one wants that to happen. Being a member of a group that believes irrational things makes those beliefs seem somehow normal. You look at all the other "normal" people in the group who believe what you believe and it reassures your mind that your beliefs are socially accepted because everyone else in the group thinks the same way. But the problem with that arrangement is that what is actually happening is that each member of the group is reinforcing the paranoia of everyone else.

It's a bit like the story of the emperor who rode through the streets naked. The crowd saw nothing wrong with the spectacle and were held in a collective delusion with each member of the crowd reinforcing the mistaken belief of the others. Only when an outsider cried out that the emperor was naked did the illusion vanish and the individual members of the group realise that they had been foolish.

An individual who thought that he could gain eternal life, murder unbelievers and help rule the world for a thousand years would be diagnosed as being seriously paranoid and prescribed sedating medication; they might even be restrained under a mental health order. But when such an individual is a member of a fifty thousand strong group like the Christadelphians, who all think the same way, the rational constraints of secular society no longer act to balance the person's thinking to a healthy psychological frame of mind.

Indeed, society itself tends to ring-fence such madness, labels it as a "Faith" and accords a level of respect to such a faith. It is only when a "Faith" begin to stockpile weapons, or release sarin gas on Japanese subways, or marry off underage girls to old men, or shoot a US Congressman, or fly planes into skyscrapers that society decides that the "Faith" has crossed the line between religious fantasy and reality and the leaders of the "Faith" are thrown into jail.

"Faiths" are tolerated by society just so long as the faith does not turn into reality. Christadelphians don't turn their faith into reality. They just keep patiently waiting for a return of Christ that will never happen. Society tolerates them, they reinforce each other's delusion, their children propagate the myth to the following generation and so it goes on.

It keeps going on because the faith and reality are not allowed to bump into each other. As long as the Jews hang on to a slither of Palestine the Christadelphians will forget that J Thomas told them that Christ would return in the middle of the Nineteenth Century one hundred and sixty years ago and they will keep hoping that the impossible will happen and that they will hit the jackpot when the overdue Christ makes his appearance. If Iran drops a few nuclear weapons onto Israel, or if the Israelis make a genuine peace with the Palestinians, faith will crash into reality for the Christadelphians and the bottom will drop out of the religion. Only a few die-hards will remain and the passage of time will finish them off.

Christadelphians believe in and defend their religion because of faulty cognitive bias. All the other believers in religions are similarly deceived. The fact that all the different religions claim that they hold the exclusive truth and that everyone else is mistaken is powerful evidence that they are all mistaken. The same forces for conversion operate in all religions and no less in Christadelphianism. People are born into the religion, or they marry into it, or they join in the expectation of reward, or they are lonely and desire social support. Like homeopathy, voodoo, astrology, clairvoyance, spiritualism, witchcraft, alien abduction, crop circles, water divining, flat Earth theory and similar delusions it is misguided, superstitious, na├»ve, dysfunctional thinking. It has nothing whatsoever to do with a “God”; it is a manifestation of human frailty making a mistake.

Leaving the Christadelphians

The good news is that leaving the Christadelphians is easier then ever before. Thousands of Ex-Christadelphians have successfully escaped from the sect and established successful and satisfying lives in the “normal” world outside the religion. People seem to be leaving the Christadelphians faster than at any time in its history.

The Internet provides a very effective method of providing support and encouragement to leavers and you can be assured of tremendous help from us if you have the courage to cleanse your mind from the poison of distorted Christadelphian thinking.

Like us, you will find the social upheaval of leaving to be upsetting because your previous Christadelphian friends will almost certainly reproach and reject you for your bravery in rejecting their dogma. Like us, you will feel the shame and guilt that you once believed crazy things. But we ex-Christadelphians are a thousand times stronger than the people that we have left behind because at last we are thinking rationally.

Intelligent, sensible human reasoning has been the driving force of human progress throughout all of history and that same force is now operating to bring an end to Christadelphian dogma, doctrine and the whole ridiculous eschatology. I implore you to open your eyes and realise that what the Christadelphians call “The Truth” is actually a ragbag of lies and paranoid thinking. Your road to discovering truth must commence by walking down a path that is called disbelief. If you have the nerve to undertake that journey you will free your mind from Christadelphian captivity and, like us, you will pity the poor souls who remain, waiting for a Kingdom that throughout the ages of eternity - is never going to happen.

72 comments:

  1. I feel vindicated, heh heh. Thanks John for that great post.

    I left the Christadelphians in 1980 and not because of anything doctrinal but because I was one of those "converted" from outside. And, that's the way I was treated, as an outsider.

    When I was going through a difficult time, they all deserted me and fled. I never went back.

    I suppose I should thank my old ecclesia for showing me their true selves.

    They are a bunch of people who have no empathy or sympathy for anyone other than their own and as you point out, they're all family. Anyone else is an outsider, even if they are a member of Christadelphia.

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  2. THANK YOU John for your wonderfully incisive posts. How can we get these things into the hands of Christadephians? I left in 1984 and the same cycles of soul destroying schism, scandal,ambition and fanatic puritianism keep afflicting them.
    Craig Fairweather, Sydney Australia

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  3. Hmmm...I have to say I find your attitude confusing, John.
    You say you are not attacking CDs...well, I'd hate to see what you do consider to be an attack!
    The insults are in every other sentence!! And sweeping generalisations based on very little evidence (for example, accusing ekim of thinking only evil thoughts!! Stunningly aggressive...).

    This site comes over very bitter indeed, and makes assumptions based on your experience.
    Generally speaking, a calm approach is better to persuade people, rather than the agressive approach (which usually promotes a defensive response).
    Reading your post actually makes me feel sorry for you. I feel no bitterness towards CDs (except perhaps those that mistreated you), and that's perhaps the key point.
    You're clearly not yet free from whatever trap you felt you were in.
    I know some CDs - one or two of them show *some* of the traits you mention - as do a proportion of the population irrespective of religious status. The rest of them are so different to what you describe that your article makes me wonder whether there's something Christadelphia/Christadelphians that's worth looking into, as it clearly generates an intriguing debate!
    I hope you find peace in your life to move on.

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  4. Heh Heh, Hey John, Since you have been a Ex member so far back as 1986, why are you wasting all this pent up energy on Christadelphians mate, as all you are doing my friend is making the faith of those in it grow stronger when you write up these sorts of comments,because the way you go on here, you are the one living in a life of delusion with all those Harry Potters out there with this dribble you have written.

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  5. I have read the posts left by ex-Christadelphians with utter disbelief. A more deluded set of people I have never encountered. I am a Christadelphian by choice, so is my husband. He researched many religions before choosing the Christadelphians so-called 'cult'. I feel very sorry that all of you only encountered Christadelphians who were clearly not behaving as God commands and yes, we have encountered such folk. Christadelphians do not claim to be spiritual beings only HUMAN beings and as such they behave like human beings. It is very wrong to treat people outside of the body of Christadelphians as 'outsiders' and those doing so will find themselves wanting in the eyes of the Lord. The Word of God tells us to welcome everyone and after the first commandment of love the Lord you God we are told to love your neighbour as yourself. This is very important. Christadelphians should try to live their lives according to the commands of Christ which means loving everybody. That is not to say that it is right to condone those people who are flagrantly disobedient to the word of God and do not seek to change their ways, we simply follow the Word of God. Read your bibles. God states quite clearly what is acceptable in a person and what is not. The rant on these pages is the rant of bitter people who failed to know God and lost their faith. Christadelphians should never claim to be the only ones who have 'got it right'. I believe that the real principles should be to Love the Lord God and his son Jesus Christ, love your neighbours, repent and be baptised and try to live your lives according to the advice given by the Lord Jesus Christ and his deciples. I hope that you bloggers read this. I am not brainwashed, this is my choice. We ALL have faults but try to see the best in people instead of spreading such negative vitriol. John Bedson uses the term 'lunatic cult' and I would say that it takes one to know one because your terminology John smacks of lunacy. I am very sorry for you indeed, try your hardest not to be so bitter and twisted because you appear to be in a very poor state indeed. I hope that you turn to your Bible and to your God again because that will be your only salvation.

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    1. hi maureen im not yet converted but i do get picked up to attend meetings at the christadelphian church and we are looking at baptisim but im confused by the things people are saying ive never been treated as an out sider ive felt nothing but love and acceptance

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  6. Unfortunately, Maureen, people don't realize that they have been indoctrinated or "brainwashed" and believe it can't happen to them.

    If you've ever tried to convert a devout Catholic to Christadelphianism, then you should realize how wrong that assumption is.

    How long has it been since you questioned anything you've believed? Well, that's too long.

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  7. Hello John boy. Blimey that chip must be huge. Anyway, you're absolutely right, of course people follow the religions of their parents but where you are wrong is that doesn't stop people thinking independently. Just like you thought independently and left, other people choose to think independently and stay. Ever thought about that? And ditto other comments, to spend so much time on this is actually making you look like a sandwich short of a picnic mate - do yourself a favour and get a hobby...

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  8. This is an important discussion and you should create an entry on the Rick Ross Institute (Cult Information) website, directing people to it. There is a lengthy dialogue on the Rick Ross Institute website about Christadelphianism and some of the wreckage it has created in individuals' lives. Keep in mind one point: "There are none so blind as those who refuse to see."
    For many Christadelphians, no matter what logic or reasoning you place before them, they will cling to what they know and are comfortable believing. They don't let reality or facts get in their way. That's the rich thing about "faith," you don't have to back it up with anything other than blind spiritualism.

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  9. Hi, I come from a Christadelphian family and had the usual indoctrination and normalisation applied to me. It was only because I am capable of independent thought that I refused to join, much to my parents concern, and went on to have quite a nice life outside the constraints of religion.
    From an early age, I somehow just knew that it was a load of nonsense. However, I was still obliged by my parents to attend the meetings and sunday school, even though I found them mind-numbingly tedious and just switched off until I could go home.
    It amazed me that all of my peers one by one got baptized into the "truth" and became brothers and sisters themselves. Eventually, when I was about 14, my parents accepted that I had no interest in the CD's and I never went to another meeting again.
    Recently, my sisters son was baptised into the faith at the tender age of 17. I find it bizarre that someone of such a young age should be allowed to join up at all, as he is not the most mature of young men. As part of the group normalisation, large numbers of youngsters were bussed in from ecclesias to witness the baptism, in the hope that they would follow his example.
    Thank you for your blog - it rang several bells as I read it. I just find it extraordinary that otherwise intelligent and level-headed people should allow themselves to be fooled on a daily basis and live their lives constrained by a 2000 year old storybook and an imaginary friend who lives in the sky.

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    1. Ha! Ha! I came upon this site quite by accident, and the post from Anonymous, above, could have been written by me! The first three paragraphs mirror my first 14 years exactly! Thankfully religion-free ever since. A great read!

      - Jules, England.

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    2. Ditto to the 2 posts above. I know all my CD relatives feel sorry for me, but they are the delusioned ones to feel sorry for. What a waste of one's only lifetime to spend it all believing in fairy tales! Biblical stories were a common style of story-telling at that time with some grains of truth as to geography, etc so people could relate to them and the resulting message was only meant to be a lesson in life, not factual history lessons!

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  10. I like these debates. I actively look for them. I have recently, within the last two years been baptised. I am old, in my thirties, and lived my life in the world before realising my mistake. Many are called, but few are chosen, is one of my favorite verses. Because i have seen the world, and what it has to offer. I choose God, every day and twice on Sundays, not because i come from a delph family, but because i searched out god myself, and i found him. I'm not arrogant enough to think ill make it into the kingdom, but i'd rather try and be on God's side than not. I hope you turn back from the path you have chosen, because Christ is coming, and you will need to justify yourself to him on that day. Take it easy.

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  11. I hope you turn back from the path you have chosen, because Christ is coming, and you will need to justify yourself to him on that day.

    That's what the faithful said one thousand nine hundred and some odd years ago too. But, at least a few had the courage to ask, "where is the promise of his coming?" Guess what? You will be dead and forgotten and Christ will still not return because the one they called Christ, Jesus, died on a Roman cross and he's not returning - ever.

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  12. John, where is your evidence that there isn't a God? Show me yours and ill show you mine. Except you have already seen it. Did you know that the prophecies in Daniel about the coming kingdoms were so accurate that for a while historians tried to prove it was written 300 years after it actually was? (They failed, no evidence) And did you know that the reforming of the state of Israel was predicted? No matter, lets just stick with the big bang. First, there was nothing. Then it exploded. Humans think they are so clever. Truth is, we know so very little. You can have your beliefs and ill have mine, but it would be prudent to at least keep your mind open, as, lets face it, you don't know everything.

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  13. I live in Virginia. My life has been wreckage since leaving the Christadelphians. I have a family and a profession, but feel completely lost in the world. I feel I don't belong anywhere, despite having joined a mainstream church. My family and I are completely shunned by Christadelphian communities. Part of me can't believe I won't return to them; it feels unnatural to be separate from them and it feels inevitable that one day we must go back. I don't understand these feelings, and I don't understand the sense of grief and betrayal I feel for having left the community. We feel like we are not a part of the Christadelphian community, yet also not a part of "the real world." It culminates in feelings of intense depression and alienation and anxiety, and we don't know where to turn for help. We had hoped after some time these feelings would end, but they haven't changed. It is as if our destiny was that we be a part of Christadelphianism, yet somehow unnaturally reality has sent us in another direction, causing us to cease to have purpose or meaning.

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    1. I felt lost until I became a Catholic in my twenties. I was writing a book against the Catholic Church, having no plan to consider the Catholic Faith, and, as a Jew attached to the greater non-Christian Jewish community, I always felt tossed by the waves in all protestant groups.
      The christadelphians never existed until a few years ago in history, and all through Christian history, Catholics were at home in CHRIST.

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    2. I meant "unattached" where I wrote "attached".

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    3. Hi
      I am a Christadelphian. As part of that community I recognise that Christadelphians are as flawed as any one else. We are just human and make the same mistakes. I believe that when a member leaves that he should not be cut off - This is a sad misconception. Christadelphia should not be judged by its members but by what scripture says.The Bible is full of evidence and it is only by regular prayerful reading that this evidence will become apparent to you.. To the Christadelphian who left, if you believe then don't go away but try to shape your ecclesia to show the Love of Christ.

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    4. Hi Matthew,
      How can you not judge Christadelphia by what Christadelphia (the members) do? If you are a believer, then certainly the reaction to misdemeanours or out-of-the-norm- ideas expressed, should be scripturally based.
      But, so many who have tried to "shape your ecclesia" and have felt the full force of the AB`s wrath on their collar.

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  14. All people in all times past have had gods and goddesses that they believed in and trusted.

    And even though their gods didn't exist, arguments against their gods were futile because they had faith in their gods. Which just goes to show that believing doesn't make it so.

    Nothing has changed either, not even for this post-modern era. People will continue to live in their delusions and their wishful thinking will continue to rule over their lives.

    Once people can force themselves and their children to believe in absurd and impossible things for which they have no evidence, it's pretty much over for their lives and their minds.

    It's sad that these people can no longer even help themselves - even though there is now an Internet with a wealth of information. No, they will live in denial of history and science or anything else that disagrees with what they WANT to believe. But, just as with the ancients, it won't make it so.

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  15. Have listened to these discussions silently, but with a veteran's interest.

    There are five Christadelphian churches in my area. Some of these are Unamended Branch meetings, others are Amended Branch meetings. I attended one of the meetings, and found whatever the members believed in terms of doctrine (and sometimes there were actually conflicting doctrinal beliefs amongst the members) the supposed "spirit" of their faith was largely lacking. The eccentrics, oddballs, mental patients, widows, and cripples were social untouchables, just like in the larger society. No one invested any real time in them. There was also a self-appointed monster who considered himself the "ruler" of the church I was attending, a genuine kick-ass who enforced the rules, administered punishments, dictated how doctrine should be interpreted, and thinned out the herd when he thought it necessary. His behavior was exactly the opposite of the behavior scripture asks us to follow, but no one in the church ever stood up to him or yanked on his reins. He'd scream you down if you angered him, and if you were genuinely unlucky he'd show up at your front door and barge his way into your home to denounce you for some perceived violation of the rules. It was a church run on fear and intimidation, and some of the children in the church lived in terror of the gentleman;
    I know, because I was once one of them. Between that and the doctrinal confusion, I ended up fleeing from the congregation. I also noticed some Christadelphians don't even follow the most basic tenets of their faith; they are supposed to be nonviolent but I was aware of occasional violence in some of their households. They aren't supposed to vote, but some secretly do so. We can attribute some of this to human weakness and personalities, but at some point the institution/church itself must be perceived as faulty.

    Departees have taken the biggest step via the act of departing. It helps to review other dissenting opinions; as a previous poster indicated, there are interesting and enlightening threads of conversation at the Rick Ross Institute and Help.com and at other sites, all of which will refer you to additional sources and defectors. It is also extremely important to acknowledge that they've messed with your head: after I uttered my first criticisms of their "Truth" several years ago, I was haunted by a terrible paranoia God would punish me by taking the lives of my children. I know that sounds incredible, but it jived with the image of a wrathful and vengeful God that the Christadelphians had instilled in me. So expect some mental and emotional complications and be gentle with yourself but also patient and courageous in overcoming them.

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  16. "...that I was such an ass to have championed the Christadelphian cause."

    Your words.

    Now why shouldI suppose that you're not being the same monumental ass in taking up your current position?

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  17. John BEdson, you are a very sad person to have all this bitterness for these years

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  18. This religion is a mind control,the preaching members pound the"CD truth"continously to their folk,relentless bible sessions,people can not think for themselves,many sessions regarding"end of time"kingdom on earth,worldly events as they happen,quickly tied to the bible,Russian's say something about the middle east,invasion of Syria is immenant a cry comes out,look back at the history of CD's they have been doing this since 1860's,you guys are obcessed,no one can predict the future,it is a guessing game for you,I can not believe you are so gullible,we know"because we read the bible" yeah right,so many failed predictions and goes on and on...

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  19. Hi Jules,
    Thanks for your comments regarding my experiences growing up in a CD family. It still baffles me how well educated family members can swallow the nonsense that they are absorbed in almost every day. They just live inside a safe christadelphian bubble, where all their friends are CDs, all they talk about is the CDs and no-one ever questions anything at all.
    I have the occasional attempt to "save me" by some well meaning but totally misguided CD at family gatherings, but these are easily defused simply by pointing out a few facts and home truths.
    Best wishes.

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  20. Hi John. I am very late in discovering this site. Wish I could have been here earlier. Thanks heaps for setting things straight with the Christadelphians, which are a vicious bunch of human beings so far from the love and peace they claim to own. Denial cannot be gain said, so just bounce those accusations of bitterness right off. It's a magnificent site here. Maybe some day those who couldn't accept it will. It's a great thing for humanity to oppose destructive cultic denial, stand to their face and bounce off their fear, give them a challenge and leave them to make what they want of it.

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    1. Christadelphians are most certainly not "a vicious bunch of human beings".

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    2. Most are peaceful. But not everyone. In my devoutly religious Christadelphian family and church, violence was sometimes present. Church elders pounding their fists on table tops, when someone made comments perceived as threatening their authority. The same elders making unannounced visits to pound on errant members' front doors. Parents engaging in child abuse, because they felt the Bible's contents allowed for it. Husbands manhandling their wives, to assert their God-given authority. It was irregular, but it sometimes happened.

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  21. Sir, may I ask. What world do you want us to go with?

    And how beautiful is it? Is it SO BEAUTIFUL that you want us to go with you?

    If it's a world without pain, hunger, sorrow, mortality, etc. Then I'll be happy to join you, with honor if you want.

    Can you please describe the world you want us to see. :)
    Have a blessed day. -young girl (15) :)

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  22. I was raised a christadelphian and attended a christadelphian sunday school as a child. However as I was growing up I began to question things about my beliefs. Through much bible studying and questioning, I have come to realize that christadelphianism is right. This is not something forced on me, not at all. I stopped attending sunday school at a young age, of my own free will. During my early to mid twenties I even began takinh an interest in the occult, and opposed anything to do with the cfhurch. Like you, I despised christadelphians. I never thouhjt I would go back to that way of thinking. Turning my back on christ led me to the worst torment and depression I had ever felt. At first I felt liberated, but I was deluded. Christ saved me, and now my faith is stronger than ever.

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  23. John,

    You left the Christadelphians 28 years ago. Don't you think your being a big whiny cry baby? Listen to what some of the above people are saying, you make yourself look like a qauck. That's not what anyone with a "bright" brain would do. Let GO and move on! Your nothing but a mean BULLY. Stop picking on these people move on with your life.


    Mr Spock

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    1. Who is the bully and self righteous? Linda and I would put a profile but don't quite know how.

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  24. John, You said that Christadelphians are "simple folk" a nice word for uneducated idiots. That is not true. Most attend university and are doctors, biologists chemists and so on. They are also some of the nicest people you will find.


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  25. I mean "simple-minded" when it comes to religion. Their cognitive biases take over and their thinking on religion becomes shallow and simplistic. It's not their fault. I was exactly the same when I was a Christadelphian. That's why I am so ashamed of my years in the religion. I've had a hugely successful life. I'm a real smart guy who has achieved a great deal. But when I was a Christadelphian, confirmation bias ran riot in my brain and I acted like an idiot.

    Christadelphians ARE clever, but they behave like idiots when it comes to their faith. They are in a tightly controlled religion that in all but name is a cult. It's only after you leave that you realise the appalling stupidity of believing all that paranormal, supernatural, superstitious stuff and you feel like throwing up because you have been so foolish for so long.

    That's why it is so hard to leave the Christadelphians or any cult or sect. When clarity of mind hits you it is highly upsetting and disturbing. It is like awakening from a bad dream that you thought was normal. That's why we at Ex-Christadelphians work to support people coming out of the religion, to ease their return to normal behaviour in society. That's why we study the natural basis of Christadelphian behaviour, to seek to understand how this religion blights people's lives and how its victims can be helped.

    Because Christadelphians are not brethren and sisters of Christ. That is all a mad fantasy. They are victims of a dysfunctional sect.

    Cult and sect members can NEVER see it when they are members. They have to be rescued. Christadelphians are no different. We Ex-Christadelphians seek to rescue some of them from the insanity of their sect.

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  26. John & Corky

    You both go on like a bunch of whiny girls! Those mean rotten christadelphians didn't love me blah blah blah! I'm such a victim! Boo Hoo Hoo!

    Pathetic, you make me want to throw up!

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  27. You two should be on a Jerry Springer talk show!

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  28. This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

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  29. I am a Christadelphian and I agree with you John. It shows the true character of some. And there day will come. It has bothered me the lack of Christ like behavior also. I know there has been mean things said in the name of God and I am so sorry. Linda

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  30. How do you know this person is even a Christadelphian saying these things? It could be anyone. By the way John you are acting like a whiny girl and you are very mean and hateful towards these people, so I agree with anonymous.

    Mr Spock

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  31. The whole point of the CD religion was not to put your faith in man i.e a priest, pope etc. but in the Lord. All this discussion is about how youve been mistreated as a human being by another human (a borther or sisier) being. The word is not just for CD's its for everyone. CD's have the same problems, addictions, sins, flesh as you and me, and the tounge is the worst offender. CD's rejecting you is not God rejecting you. However you are now rejecting God your father which I am more concerned about. You dont need to be a CD to follow God. Its a fellowship of like minded individuals, find a new eccleasure but get back to the word and you will find God again.

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    1. For the past 18 years I have enjoyed an amazingly close relationship with God in the company and fellowship of others that truly love their Lord. I believe there is nothing I can do to earn my salvation, as Jesus has done it all on my behalf, and as a direct response to this amazing gift, and the enormity of what He did for me, I will continue to live my life according to His word, in Glory to Him. I had to move to the other side of the world to free myself from the knowledge that I would never be good enough to be accepted into the kingdom of God, and my sins (of which there were many) would never be forgiven as I was now out of the ''Truth". I was 5th generation Christadelphian and had the additional responsibility of being a direct descendant of the esteemed Robert Roberts , and when I eventually was able to extricate myself and discover who my Saviour was, 18 years ago, my mother, who sadly died a month ago, told me I had discarded my first love....the Christadelphians...and all our family fought for....to which I replied, ...I have just found Him. I was baptised as a teenager as most of us were, not out of Faith, but as an obligation to my heritage, and to please my parents and grandparents. In my experience, the Christadelphians were lovely kind people, and that opinion hasn't changed, the care of my mother was exemplary, but I do feel they are missing out on the joy of assurance (please read Romans, the NIV version) and living life not believing they are good enough. My mother and fathers dying words were that they wouldn't presume to be saved, even though it clearly says that their sins were all paid for at the cross. Their concern was , even after a lifetime of service, that they may have forgotten to seek forgiveness for sins they would have committed leading up to their death. The Gospel means GOOD NEWS. There doesn't seem much hope in the knowledge that Jesus Christ did it all for us. There are so many discrepancies in the doctrine of Christadelphianism, according to the scriptures, and even though it doesn't rest easy with me to call the faith a cult, by definition, a cult is a group that follows a leader/s and their interpretation of the Truth, and my advice to any Christadelphians reading this is to find your answers in the Word of God, the Bible, where you will find your hope, not Elpis Israel. Those are men's words, not inspired by God. There is a very accurate critique on what the Christadelphians believe called The Christadelphian cult by Rev. Paul Seiler. Coming from both places, having been steeped in the Christadelphian faith for so long and the burden that was on me personally, and now knowing the joy and freedom of having a personal relationship with Jesus through the comfort of his Holy spirit , I ask anyone reading this to seek prayerfully this for themselves. Love and blessings to you all, Julia

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    2. Just wondering if my comments came through.

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  32. Think about the logic behind all of this. Person A has faith in eternal salvation. Person B has no faith, does not believe God exists, all hope and life end at the point of death. If "B" is correct then both "A" and "B" are dead for ever when their lives end. Neither one is benefitted by anything said or done in their life. If person "A" is correct then person "B" is dead in the end, but person "A" goes on to something better in the resurrection. The assumption is that only one of them can be correct. Which possibility is more appealing? There is only hope in one path. Choose life. Choose logic. If everyone dies in the end, what's the point of "saving" Christadelphians from their faith? In the end it won't matter. But there is a point in saving atheists from their non-faith if there truly is an eternity waiting for you. God does exist. The Lord Jesus Christ is alive and calling to you. Stop kicking against the goads and open your eyes.

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    1. "if there truly is an eternity" and "God does exist...The Lord Jesus Christ is alive and calling to you" seems a little bit contradictory. As you say, it should be up to each person to choose what is more "appealing" to them. Including this current life which is a definite.

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    2. Your life is not meaningless if you fail to follow certain religious teachings. Your life has whatever substantive meaning you decide to create for it. Live it.

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  33. Each man to his own religion; for some Christadelphianism and for others Atheism. There is a religion for every man under the sun and for every man seeking religion there will be one waiting to make a new disciple of him.

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    1. (Ex-Christadelphian since 1972)
      Let me correct your assumption about Atheism, Anonymous of June 25, so it can become more clear.
      Atheism is NOT a religion, any more than Non-stamp Collecting is a hobby.

      Atheism is (instead) a rational rejection of superstition.

      My only remaining relative in 'that faith' is my youngest brother who quite lately suffered a nervous breakdown (partly due to factors such as medical causes, solitary homelife, and hereditary factors) and who's been "re-claimed" by a Brother/Sister team in their seventies.

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    2. Fed Up With ReligionSeptember 10, 2016 at 12:28 PM

      To Anon,

      It always amazes me the the ignorance of religious people in that you dont even read nor understand the book you cliam to be devinly inspired, but written by men, and clutch onto it for dear life.

      Mathew 6:33 But seek ye first the kingdom of God

      Very specific...

      Ok, so where is it you may ask??

      Luke 17:21 Neiher shall they say, Lo here! or lo there! for behold, THE KINGDOM OF GOD IS WITHIN YOU.

      I wonder what that means...you look in the mirror...

      Christianity/Christadelphianism/Religion is a living, walking, talking contradiction.

      The myhical "SUN" of God Jesus scorned religion, but you ignore that part or claim he wasn't talking about your religion...rubish.

      So while you all wait for the "SUN" of God to "come in the clouds" and murder everyone who doesn't believe what you do, I will live my life free from guilt and fear because i can read.

      Meditate on that for a minute, oh, and put the bible down, ask yourself some questions and do some research on what it is you have been told and think you know.

      Fed Up

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  34. John....I have had a really strange relationship and fathered a child with a Christadelphian girl. It was a trip. I have a lot of questions and concerns if you are interested in talking.

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  35. I was brought up into a christadelphian family and five years ago I turned my back on the belief and wanted to find out about life for myself without being dictated to and led like a sheep. Only recently have I found my faith in the lord, after spending time away you realise how much of a difference faith makes to your life. Whether or not what we believe becomes true or is ever proven, it is evident that those people who believe lead much healthier and enjoyable lives. I would rather believe I have someone by my side at all times than no one at all, if I am proven wrong and when we die there is no salvation then so be it but at least it comforted me at that time I needed help and made those hard times easier in this life.

    I spent many years with those who live with god, and those that don't. It is so clear to me that those that have faith lead far greater lives. The majority are generous, forgiving, kind, helpful, unselfish, accepting and never make you feel judged (just a few to name). Others that dont believe live their lives for themselves and are generally much less content with life.

    and this is coming from someone who lost his faith completely. I wanted to find answers for myself.

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  36. Bedfool, you just want to push atheism and get street cred with your fellow haters by slagging off at Christadelphians. You say God commits genocide etc.? Well what about your atheist hero Stalin?
    Or won't we worry about that?
    I'm not a Christadelphian, but you make me want to join them

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    1. Anonymous of 16th Jan.6pm:
      You`re welcome here, but no need for gratuitous rudeness in addressing your posting fellows.
      And as for making you "want to join them" (the Christadelphians), would they have you?
      John, wasn`t the God of the Old Testament just mythically evil? Stalin was with us in real life and much up front.

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    2. But even if he exists , the stories about him could be myths, the writers wanting to make "their" god appear to be the top god, the most powerful god, a god capable of inflicting terrrible acts upon the neighbouring tribes because "He" told us to do these terrible acts in his name. So don`t mess with us.

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    3. Anon,
      Feel free to join the Christadelphians, there are plenty of spaces. You will need to pick a name for yourself for the register though.
      Can you tell us where you got the idea that Stalin is a hero to anybody here?
      Yes indeed, Stalin was a nasty man, but don't forget that you will be required to "Greatly Thin" the population in the coming kingdom if you do sign up to join.
      Nobody here hates the Christadelphians, even me, and I'm not over nice about them. What we do hate is people, especially young vulnerable people, being told a pack of lies by the Christadelphians, and we all of us here have plenty of experience of that.
      Come back and make a nice sensible post and we will help you to make your choice about joining them or not.

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  37. John, I think that I did suffer as a child from 5 to 15 under the strict tutelage and rigorous bible teachings not to mention the social class issues. I actually do have clear evidence that their harsh treatment harmed me. Likewise, my parents turning away their heads so that they did not have to see the cruelty I suffered at the hands of the Ecclesia members and themselves. Deprived of normal social interactions with my peers I still have difficulty. However, your assertions concerning God are without evidence as are assertions to the contrary. I left the Christadelphians just before I was due to be baptized. It caused me no end of grief because of the disruption my leaving caused my family.

    Now I was just a kid, not a particularly smart kid, but how can one be informed when the only media permitted is the bible and whatever the school system threw at me. Quite difficult to get perspective really. I'm not over it and I will likely go to my grave without being over it. The difference is that I have had to forgive my entire family, the entire Ecclesia and those persons who shunned me after I left the Ecclesia. Forgiveness is a salve that eases pain. You need to forgive the Ecclesia and those Christadelphians who caused you pain. Then perhaps you can make a more reasoned argument against the Christadelphian movement, which I would applaud. Blaming God, whether or not you believe him to be real or not is evidence that you do believe in God, otherwise you would have nothing to say about him.

    Christadelphians are just as misled as are other religious factions of whatever faith. All the evil in the world resides in the hearts of humans, not in God, the Devil or Christadelphians.

    I am fifty-three years free of Christadelphians, but I am not free of the psychological damage done to the child in me. Forgive first, then do the work that must be done free of hatred and remorse.

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    1. John,
      Your reaction to "anonymous" is interesting. Did "his" comments cause your subconscious to ping a little? The CD indoctrination is evidently still within you and will stay there. Deep down, but still there.

      Delete
    2. I will tell you how to live John, a beer a day keeps the doctor away, no more than 12 at a time thou!!

      Delete
  38. "Is it God's purpose in the "Latter Days" to confer salvation only on the descendents of a tiny number of families primarily in the Anglo-Saxon English speaking area of the world? The Bible certainly does not predict such a bizarre outcome. So why has it worked out that way for the Christadelphians?"

    John, this is bizarrely short-sighted. Isn't one of the core teachings of Christadelphia that the truth is for Gentiles, everyone who isn't Jewish? I agree that many ecclesias see the truth as exclusive to white, middle-class and self-important people, i.e. themselves, but this isn't what the Bible teaches at all. If they want to believe/preach that it does while believing they are the privileged few than that's their error and theirs alone.

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    1. Asa,
      If many Ecclesias see it as exclusive to the white middle class and believe it, then it is indeed their error. If they then preach this, against Bible truth then it is not simply their error. What they have become is false teachers, and earn the condemnation of God by leading others astray.
      This why it is so important to think before joining them. Do they alone have the truth or are they being influenced by being so exclusive as to have lost sight of the world outside and cannot relate to it properly?
      If you like, I will tell you how to "test" your Ecclesia to see which camp they fall into.

      Delete
  39. What gets me is how you still say you have the truth... after years and years of failed predictions can you be so sure you have the truth... ok have a faith but don't be so dog- matic , you don't know if you are any closer to the truth than any-one else... time has proven that many times over..and is going to again and again... the Ukraine is just another example.... would you not be better to just wait and see... what happens in stead of getting peoples hopes up and it comes to nothing....

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    1. Paul,
      Very simple really. Christadelphianism isn't a "living" faith at all. It is faith in the interpretation of a book that is believed to tell the future, but does not have relevance to the present.
      Here is a quote from the Swanwick Family Bible School site:

      "This Family Bible School has worked well for two reasons: firstly and most important, that our Heavenly Father has blessed the work, and secondly because of the whole hearted involvement of children and brethren and sisters who attend."

      Now read this by me:

      "This Eurovision Song Contest has worked well for two reasons: firstly and most important, that our Heavenly Father has blessed the work, and secondly because of the whole hearted involvement of singers and men and women who attend".

      Now tell me Paul, which statement is true, and which is absurd, and why?

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  40. Dont follow you there on the questions??..both can be absurd there is no proof of intervention..... what is your answer to the failed predictions... you know very well over the years you have got it horribly wrong... "its right now" ;now" 'its at the very doors"'at any minute now" you have got it wrong... many times over you have to admit that.....

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    1. Paul,
      That`s just Joe`s point, as you say. Both statements cannot be shown to be in any way anything to do with God. It`s all to do with Faith. And Faith is the manufactured substance of things not seen. Not Proved. Accepted only by faith. And when you start to examine that faith you find that it starts to unravel, like an attractively knitted garment, the end piece of which yarn has become loose, and can be pulled away, to the extent that the whole garment (faith) becomes unravelled.

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  41. I see Putin is pulling the troops tonight .... she is another fizzer......

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  42. many of you are criticising christadelphians as though they are horrible evil people, that hate everyone who is not apart of the religion. but from what i have found they are the nicest people i know. they are not secretly cursing everyone around them. they are very accepting of people who are not with them in the truth.

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    1. Amen, brother

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    2. Me,
      (well and Jack), these nicest people that you know. Is it that they were nice people AND Christadelphians, or nice people BECAUSE they are Christadelphians?
      I ask because I know lots of nice people, some with religion and some without, quite a few are member of what the nice Christadelphians refer to as "the apostate church", others they politely refer to as "of the world"

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    3. Hello ME (that`s "me" of September 8th), Yes, you are correct, there has been over criticism of Cd`s in this blog. But, you have to have been in the orbit and belong to the Cd`s to really know what they are like.
      Some of those who post, ex-Cd`s, have been treated very badly by Cd`s, and have every justification in saying what they`ve said.
      Mostly, CD`s are "nice" people in terms of politeness and so forth, on the surface. Where they are not nice is when someone comes up with either behaviour or belief of which they disapprove, then they go completely overboard in their reactions, because they believe that they have THE truth. About belief in what the Bible has to say. And there are hardliners who take this to the extreme in what they say about others from the platform, in books and pamphlets, and in how they treat their fellows, both in and out of Christadelphia. It`s not quite as straightforward as you might think.Scratch the surface and you might find out.
      Hope we don`t get too many "Me`s", it will be like too many Anons. We won`t know our me`s from our me`s or our anon`s from our anon`s.

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    4. Joe, some of both.

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  43. #1, Christadelphianism is a religion very much shut out from the true reality of the world (by choice), choosing what to accept and what to be sheltered from, the only other place (im not very familiar with the going on around the world) I can find other such similarities is in that of modern day north korea, and in germany during the holocaust, I believe a lot of what is peddled within the CD's was purely "propoganda" which has no only done more harm than good in my life but set me up for an unrealistic expection of life. and.... #2 I know deep down to my core and truely believe with all my heart that I will and can do everything to instill in my children family values, forgiveness, empathy, Love, truth, and so on without phsychologically destroying them. my final note on this is, I found more love outside "the truth" than i ever did within, I found better family (words can't describe how greatful I am for the family i found) they are also two very happy grandparents to my beautiful daughter and I found all of this in "wordly sinners" not in the ecclesia. if there are any CD's in New Zealand that want to get out or would like to talk about my experience and things you can do to help unravel the damage done, I'm here if you need to talk. I truely understand just how difficult it is to leave the life behind including in some cases your family and friends,

    Warmest Regards
    Mike

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